New Canon Rebel competition for Sony (what do you think?)
Canon just announced the new Rebel T3i/600D and the RebelT3/1100D. You can read the specs and previews at Dpreview. All in all Canon didn’t bring any big innovation and as usual they proved to have a very conservative product strategy. But we must admit, Canon is selling Rebels like hotcakes so why should they change the philosophy? And now it’s your turn. What do you think?
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rob
2 years ago |Sony wyprodukowało 5 modele lustrzanek:
1. a100-390
2. a450-560
3. a580
4. a700
5. a850-900
wszystkie szumią i przy wysokim iso zabijają szczegóły.
Słabe algorymy obrazy robią, że ludzie wybierają konkurencję.
Zrobili też, SLT z nadmiarem fioletu i jakością obrazu z przed 2 lat.
Zrobili NEX dla japończyków.
Sky_walker
2 years ago |Cieszymy sie twoim szczesciem. Tylko po co siejesz ten FUD?
Daemonius
2 years ago |Lol, you are one funny troll. And you cant even write in proper language.
D.Ortego
6 months ago |Use to be a Canon shooter and I think Sony will leave them in the dust by this time next year.
Vlad
2 years ago |I am certain most people would prefer the A580, but I think the poll misses the point.
Canon sells well for several reasons:
- wide availability
- very good customer support
- complete line of products which is regularly updated
- clear strategy
All of those give a lot of confidence to the potential customer to invest their money in the long term.
ABB
2 years ago |There are always some people buying camera like buying stocks in the exchange market: buy high and sell low.
The word “invest” is just too good to describe their acts.
They are just some fat sheep.
Real investor bets on the rising star and obviously it is not the Canon; that is why you are here.
Vlad
2 years ago |The rising star? Exchange market? You are taking my comparison way too far and investing is just giving money and expecting profit. For most people buying a system is expensive, thus requiring some thinking. Is the company going to provide regular updates? Is the company going to provide good customer support? etc. I am sure not everyone does that, but I am also sure many do.
Sky_walker
2 years ago |Well, Vlad, I for one wasn’t doing that. There were 2 matters counting for me in the topic of system itself – 1) whatever it doesn’t have any outrageous disadvantages, such as service being crap – when I bought my DSLR all of the systems were fine, now Nikon turn out to be crap, but that’s another topic. 2) If the lens choice is good, including used lenses – back in old days the 4/3s and Pentax lost the competition for me because of this (note: conditions differ depending on country).
I wasn’t looking on anything you talk about, like “good” customer support (it was fine if it wasn’t crap), regular system updates, or whatever else.
Most important thing was a camera for me. Precisely for the reason you point out – buying it is expensive and I wanted it to have best for money I had. It doesn’t mean though that I’ll be so picky about the system. Perhaps if you are experienced photographer (eg. looking for refugee from 4/3) you might look for the things you do point out, but otherwise? These are 3rd if not 4th grade things on the list of importance. Releasing single very best for the cost camera can fade these away.
Daniel
2 years ago |Just take a look at this http://www.photographyblog.com/news/carl_zeiss_joins_micro_four_thirds/
what do you make of this!? admin, have you any thoughts on this?
all of a sudden, Sony’s exclusivity regardind Zeiss lenses which do autofocus themselves isn’t such a decisive advantage over others anymore…it seems as others are getting there too, at least those who are interested. Yes, it’s an entirely different system, but this tells us that Zeiss will work with others too..
Vlad
2 years ago |I see what you mean, but this was more of a specific reply to ABB with some examples. Originally I was talking about marketing in general.
- the customer support I think depends on the people, I for one can change the whole system if the service doesn’t suit me. (agreed for Nikon btw, but Sony is still worse from my experience)
- regular system updates are not a point per se. They just add to the image and give some confidence (example, Sony doesn’t give me much confidence with how it handles the A700 successor)
But as you said those are 3rd or 4th grade on the list and beginners will probably omit them in their decision process. What they won’t omit though:
- depends on the country, but I travel a lot and most of the time it is difficult to find Sony’s pro models in a shop and play with them; Sony are big enough to address this I think.
- their US website – ridiculous errors and missing information – this was all over the blogs
etc, etc.
Compared to Canikon their marketing is non-existent. It is a pity, because everyone suffers from this – customers, because they don’t “see” Sony and thus they lose one option in their choice and Sony itself, because they make some pretty good products, but lack visibility. Some commenters pointed out that there is a lot of bias, and I agree, but that is hardly the whole image and I think it is up to Sony to a very big extent.
RB
2 years ago |No, simply because the neighbor has Canon. Because they see Canon on TV in the hand of the reporters. Because they heard that Canon would be good. Most people don’t start unbiased writing down their specs and then look what’s on the market which suits their needs. Indeed, most people don’t even know their specs. They want a DSLR. And it shouldn’t be too expensive. And it should be “good” and the lens should cover everything.
Vlad
2 years ago |What you are saying is also true. But that has also something to see with Canon’s marketing and their wide availability.
You say that people see Canon all around themselves – how do you think that happened?
Dulaney Ward
2 years ago |Mainly, it happened over a period of forty years or more–two decades at least before they displaced Nikon as #1. And, you’re right, constant marketing.
But Sony is doing a good job of marketing in the photo magazines in the US now-as much as six pages of advertising in a single issue. Some of it not directly advertising a specific camera, but building the Sony name a a major player in the dslr / system camera world.
Vlad
2 years ago |Well, I am not aware of those magazines. But I am really happy to hear that.
I think, for example, that they did a good job with the Nex – the advertising was there.
Still, as you say it is not easy. IMHO when they introduced the A700 and then the A900 they could’ve ridden (ridden – is that correct here?) on that wave much longer and higher. Today, I still don’t see them making more in the marketing department than the other competitors as they should.
Of course, my opinion is based on what I see, hear and read, and like the case of those magazines, I am probably missing some of their actions
SonyA77
2 years ago |Vlad, people buy Canon because they are told to buy Canon or Nikon, it really is as simple as that.
They are told on the Internet, they are told in the stores, they are told in the magazines. Canon and Nikon sell well due to biased users telling them that Sony, Olympus, Pentax etc., are crap.
For a newbie their purchasing decision has NOTHING to do with the points you listed and EVERYTHING to do with bias.
Vlad
2 years ago |I think you are not giving ANY credit to people. While certainly many of them do behave as you stated, that certainly isn’t everything. There are people who think and read.
And same as my answer to RB – they are told to buy Canikon by whom? By people who use those. Are they also stupid people? Following your logic everyone should be dumb!
RB
2 years ago |Vlad, it’s like this. Don’t underestimate marketing. All Canonistas around my “know” that my a900 would be crap, that the D5Mk2 would be superior to the a900, that Sony cameras in general wouldn’t be as good as Canon, etc. And then they see the IQ of my a900 and don’t believe their eyes… And then they tell me like a duck takes to water about the serious failures of their Canons, which stopped them from shooting — and they can’t believe that so far, after ~40.000 frames in 1,5 years, I had no failure at all.
Vlad
2 years ago |But I agree with you! There are those people. But that is not the whole story IMHO. My original point was that marketing and strategy do account for something. Certainly it wasn’t exhaustive, but I stand by my point.
How much of the negative feedback comes form Sony’s own users? Waiting for the A700? Having problems with customer support? Not being able to find some types of cameras in their cities? While all of this applies to basically every company, Sony is the “winner” in those cases.
Mind you, I am not bashing Sony or anything, but merely stating what IMO are their weak points. And that opinion of mine I base mostly on feedback from actual Sony users!
Sony’s marketing always sucked! And not only in their imaging division – in everything! Same for customer support. These should be improved, because no matter how good of a camera you make you will never get those customers. For me the A700/A900 are incredible cameras, but that wasn’t enough.
Surely, there’s the bias issue, but statements like from the A77, that everything is based on bias are just ridiculous – let’s just tell all those marketing people to give up and go home then.
He and you say that you see Canikon on TV, in the shops, the net, etc., but that is what I am talking about! That IS marketing. Why Sony isn’t doing that? Canikon has monopoly over the TV?
And in the end, yes, there re those “friends” trying to justify their own purchase and pushing you towards something you don’t necessarily need. But that will change with time if Sony sit on their a**es and work on their marketing for once.
So, I do not disagree with your point. I disagree that what’s happening is out of Sony’s hands and they can’t do nothing about it.
SonyA77
2 years ago |You are correct, I don’t give them any credit at all. The VAST MAJORITY are clueless about buying a dSLR and go for Canon and Nikon without bothering to test other brands.
It is a “safe” option and when you know nothing about dSLRs you’d be stupid to go with another brand. I see Sony, Pentax and Oly users as people who have looked at other brands, not the clueless majority.
You are giving the average Canikon buyer far too much credit. These people think a D3100 is a “professional camera”.
Vlad
2 years ago |Well, I think at that point we are getting quite subjective with our opinions about people so it’ll be better to end it
In any case, with all the stuff that I wrote, I would resume it like this: Sony can do better with their marketing and given that they are in a disadvantage on the market they should push even more. In fact, if Sony is the leader on the market today, I would still think their marketing isn’t enough even in that hypothetical situation. But, hey, that’s just my opinion
ChenAlan
2 years ago |The VAST MAJORITY are clueless? Well that’s not new. Hehe
I totally agree with you here, that’s why we have to “educate” them.
Daniel
2 years ago |Price and specs made me choose my first Sony, the a200 which i still have…It was the best offer back then. I was not considering an entire system by that time.
Lenses and flashes came later…a couple of years later came the a850 also, which i am still in love with, just perfect at lower ISO. When i bought the a200 in 2008 the guy from the store mentioned that it seems to be a very good deal. And it was, very decent for the money, very easy to use, reliable, good battery life, nice d-range.
The fact is that nobody said anything about Canikon.
I entered that store a few months ago. I asked the young lady to show my the nex3 they had..she said she was thinking of buying a nikon before they had the nex line in store. She said that everybody there loves that camera. She didn’t know much, but I’ve tought her a few things about how to use it.
I understood then that it was all about the concept, using nex seems to bring some kind of joy to this category of users, so this is the way it is advertised also, like a lot of fun. I think this is true for the SLTs also.
I’m just saying that nobody’s pushing people around to buy a camera blindly.
It has been said before by Vlad, he made a point..give credit to the buyer, everyones choice is made upon personal preferences but budget comes into consideration also. In the comsumer market it sometimes comes down to value for the money, more specs, stuff like that…no camera has really bad IQ these days.
Daniel
2 years ago |Look guys, together with the new cameras, Canon announced three new pro lenses. Such products need no adverstising, they speak for themselves, just look if you haven’t already at dpreview or others.
Sony is nowhere near that. That 200-400 f4 with 1.4x integrated extender is something to be desired…I know the 70-400g is a very good lens, but that is just something else..
c preece
2 years ago |The real kicker is these lenses are already 2nd generation IS lenses. Nikon is starting to produce 2nd generation VR lenses as well. Currently Sony has one long Prime (300mm 2.8.). It’s $1,600 more than the Canon and $1,000 more than the Nikon can’t imagine how much more the Sony 500mm is going to cost.
Francisco
2 years ago |In places where different brand offerings are rare, canikon is sadly king. All bias. But when I show them my pics, they cant believe what they see… and just blind themselves to the obvious reality of the superiority of SONY! All hail!
Manxtt12
2 years ago |people will buy it because it’s “Canon”.
Milos Janata
2 years ago |Sony consumer features > Canon consumer features.
But cheapest wins.
Sky_walker
2 years ago |Not cheapest. The best with prict to features factor. That’s why Sony won with A55 or A200 ages ago.
Sky_walker
2 years ago |Well, nice solid camera. Not much to add, though f/2.8 sensor is impressive here, sony doesn’t tend to use them recently somehow. Though what suprised me most is the announcement of 1100D – a competitor to A290, very very similar, though with added video and propably a better sensor. If the price will be competitive than well… Sorry Sony but there’s no reason to buy your camera anymore. :/
Milos Janata
2 years ago |U expecting sub 600$ Sony A22 now?
Sky_walker
2 years ago |Nope. More like CMOS A295. Though A22 wouldn’t do any harm if price-competitive with C1100D, would it?
Milos Janata
2 years ago |Agreed. Those bulky dslr should be much cheaper this time.
Must be even cheaper to make dslr than compact due to miniaturization issues.
A22 or A295 let´s say 420$ with kit lenses :]
Daemonius
2 years ago |Theres “rumour”, that Canon will use chip stabilisation in future models. That would bring him quite closer to Sony. And it would make Canon bit more attractive..
Though its just rumour, dont take it too seriously. (SR2 or so..)
pancanikonpus
2 years ago |omg, 600D so terrible if look from improvement prospective! what if canon can sell it at 500USD then is different story.
SonyA77
2 years ago |No innovation here, same old tired dSLRs.
mike_2008
2 years ago |The one thing which makes this attractive is the ability to record HD movies on a crop of the sensor, giving effectively a 10x zoom. Put a decent 250mm lens on that and you have a very powerful tool. Should be a feature of the new A77 too I hope.
The great thing about canon is the lenses, which work great, are not too expensive and are easy to find on ebay. They also look good in white. This specific release of the 600D is a very boring iteration though it must be said. Confirms that the SLT offers a lot more, if sony can start delivering…
idreamedof
2 years ago |My next camera will, out of necessity, be an A580, but I can hardly believe so many correspondents would actually prefer it to the 600D
ChenAlan
2 years ago |Show them the speed priority mode first hand
ginello
2 years ago |yet the video modes of these canon’s, make them very attractive.
on a different note.
canon is eating Sony pro video lunch with their 5d and 7D.
it is hard to find a compelling reason to spend over 10k for a Sony pro video camera when a 5/6k canon kit with zacuto’s or red rock, can do the job, sometimes better.
Sony video department, may well go the way of Kodak digital department which was always kept under powered to protect film sales….
Olf
2 years ago |I still prefer my nex 5 over the t3i
Neil
2 years ago |I’m still sticking with my 550D.
Sony, if you could only offer us the full manual controls for Video recording =/
pancanikonpus
2 years ago |if full manual contro in video why not GH2?
Cow Zeiss already join M43 and soon release lenses!
Milos Janata
2 years ago |no, because no wide fast lenses, no 25p, unattractive crop factor, worse photo quality( almost on par with oly epl-1), sony video AF is better.
Gh2 is nice but sony must be better!
Milos Janata
2 years ago |+1
Zstan
2 years ago |Sony a22 sounds good.
And I do agree that sony’s marketing sucks.
adamski
2 years ago |Well, the thing is that although Sony has amazing innovation in the form of SLT and NEX, fitted with great & fun technology like Sweep Panorama etc., Canon has been selling the 550D like hot cakes because of video. Now Sony has the edge, releasing compacts with 1080/60p and when this comes to SLTs and NEXes, along with good bitrate, the amateur and indie video crowd will fly back to Sony. Canon is laughable with no mirrorless offering at all, not even rumoured so i hope that they will lose a lot of market to Sony and will finally wake up and innovate like they should.
TT
2 years ago |“Canon has been selling the 550D like hot cakes because of video”
Wrong. Canon even sold cameras with no video like hot cakes
(XS). That’s not going to change. It’s brand name advantage.
Dulaney Ward
2 years ago |right; but brand name advantage can slowly be overcome.
kmfan
2 years ago |“That’s not going to change. It’s brand name advantage.”
Which only happened because reviews are favorable. Now that Sony have got their feet wet, alot is going to change.
kmfan
2 years ago |The market where the Rebel line up exist is very fickle just like any other consumer electronic product. Rebels aren’t bought by 5D/1D ‘pro’ market which tend to be more ‘brand/lens investment loyal’.
Q
2 years ago |This is an unsually weak model update from canon, coupled with the lack luster 60D I think they are trying to buy some time and hold the flood back from the competition lead by Sony and their sensors. To me it feels like they threw all their eggs into the 7D and have trickled that tech to the lesser models, where now they shared the same sensor over two generations now.
The A77 is looming and Canon have revealed their weak hand, Sony have always offered great value and feature packed cameras, and the A77 might just be the king of the 1.5 crops very soon
Steve Long
2 years ago |My real fast read of the product announcement shows me another nice camera body that would be a great choice for my grandparents and or a first camera for a young person just starting out in photography and wants a camera to build on.
As others have said, Canon also announced two new mid-level speedlights to an already impressive array of lighting accessories, and several new telephoto lenses to a glass selection that now rivals Nikon in both depth and quality. Canon is no doubt committed to both the grandparents’ photographs of grandchildren, the young person looking towards a career in photography and the professional.
This camera body is no replacement for my pair of A850 and Zeiss lens but the new telephotos are making me consider so start my move to Canon for my event work.
Good job Canon!
AVESTA
2 years ago |In the end do we really care?
We’ll be happy with our Sony products and others won’t because they have canikons.
The fact is, if Sony really wanted to they could buy out both those companies and have a monopoly on photography.
kmfan
2 years ago |They don’t have to buy out ‘Canikon’. They already have monopoly on great sensors!
AVESTA
2 years ago |True!
Daniel
2 years ago |Exactly how I feel..from the 70-200 is II upwards Canon has a great line of lenses, they’ve replaced the 300&400 f2.8 last year with newer versions too. What they need to upgrade is just the 24-70 which has no is and is worse than the sony zeiss and nikon, but not by much…it would be a joy to use the 200-400 1.4x f4 i guess..
kmfan
2 years ago |Fact is fact.
1. Sony is just getting warmed up.
2. Canon’s best compacts are VERY close to M4/3 performance.
3. M4/3 is dead until they’re willing to make affordable compacts.
4. Sony can gamble big, lose, and have enough resources to win some back, Canon .. ?
Someone mentioned, Sony consumer products have to compete with Casio. Well, everyone does. But Canon will have to make sure they don’t LOSE to Casio, because they’re losing APS-C market. Maybe their saving grace is a bridge?
knurd
2 years ago |Canon: Hey everyone! The new t3i is out!
Consumer: Cool! What’s new?
Canon: Well…it has this flippy screen thing-a-ma-jig. Isn’t it neat-o?
Consumer: Umm…that’s it?
Canon: Well…pretty much.
Consumer: Wow, that doesn’t seem like much of an improvement…almost how badly the 60D upgrade sucked.
Canon: Shut up and buy it.
Consumer: Okay. I’ll only buy it because I see people on craigslist switching from Nikon to Canon all the time so there must be a good reason. And when I find out that reason then it’ll all be worth it.
alex
2 years ago |well, at least canon actually brought this camera on the market, together with a working 500/4, a 600 and a 200-400 that does work, instead of all the crappy rumors, mockups and so on, that sony seems to deliver at this moment..
SonyA77
2 years ago |These Canon models are basic updates of EXISTING ones, nothing new here!
You forget that Sony in the meantime has updated the A2xx line, the A3xx line, released the A450, updated the A5xx line and released the completely new A33 and A55. Added to that they have the NEX-3 and NEX-5 lines.
Sony have been churning cameras much faster than Canikon or anybody else. The fact that you don’t want them is irrelevant, Sony had to concentrate on the budget end first, its where the volume sales and money is.
Mike_2008
2 years ago |I’ve decided to go with the canon.
copzz
2 years ago |Why? A580 is much better.
SonyA77
2 years ago |IMO anybody who can wait six months should not be buying a dSLR right now.
AVESTA
2 years ago |yup… big things are coming up!