Rumor roundup: Fixed lens APS-C camera to be announced in Summer. Hybrid E-A mount cam in 2013.
I am being asked by some SAR readers what’s the news on the fixed lens APS-C model and the Hybrid camera concept. The news I have says that the APS-C camera with fixed lens a là DSC-R1 (here on eBay) will arrive this summer and compete against the Canon G1 X ($799). Like the Canon it uses a very compact zoom lens and not a prime lens like the Sigma DP series the Fuji X100 and Leica X1.
The hybrid E-A or (A-E?) mount camera that will bring full support for both lens systems is still in being developed and will not come before 2013. At that stage I really don’t know how this camera will look and what exactly Sony wants to do in terms of design and features. How this will work remains a bit of a mystery. I only can think on a similar solution of the Zeiss Ikon Contax I, II and III that can still be found here on eBay.
After the May 17th NEX-F3 and Sony A37 announcement I will intensively work on the next A99 Full Frame camera release. I am crossing my finger that this will become a great camera!
Vivek
2 years ago |Admin: Thank you and keep up the good work!
hini
2 years ago |Yes, I want a new DSC-R1. It was a wonderful camera. Perfect lens, perfect handling, perfect build quality, great sensor. Only problem – too slow. We need a DSC-R1 with a up to date processor!
And: Thank you for your good work!
Sky_walker
2 years ago |I really hope this will be what Sony gonna make instead of yet another X100-wanna-be.
Matthew Durr
2 years ago |They should definitely leave that market alone for Fuji and Leica (X1) to duke it out.
http://matthewdurrphotography.wordpress.com
c
2 years ago |exactly they should leave ALL camera market alone!!! sony suck
Rooru S.
2 years ago |why so much hate towards Sony? don’t get it.
Sky_walker
2 years ago |I got a different question: While bother with posting BS when you know you’ll be flamed?
Perhaps you should leave ALL websites free from stupid comments?
c
2 years ago |thanks out to matthew durr for stupid comment to getting stupider! and also thank to skywalker for not realize he is next to none brains.
Carl
2 years ago |“stupid comment to getting stupider”
“not realize he is next to none brains”
That’s our education dollars right there, folks.
Bernd
2 years ago |Thanks for the info! Really, I like that more and more high end compacts enter the market, but I don´t know how an APS-C compact makes sense for sony. They have an APS-C Compact System, so what´s the meaning about a Camera with a fixed lens. (Suggesting that Canon builds up a System around the G1X sensor, Sony would go the other way around…)
Anyways, I would prefer a smaller sensor, large aperture Camera (like the Fuji X10) over a huge sensor, slow aperture Camera.
Steve
2 years ago |A fixed lens allows Sony to develop the sensor microlenses on this camera specificially for this one lens. That allows them to create a much more compact lens without impacting IQ.
This is why the G1X and X100 have such compact lenses. You would never be able to do this with the NEX system as the sensor needs to cover a wide lens range.
onigorom
2 years ago |Also, not all folks want to deal with lenses. Some are waiting for a large sensor compact with good IQ and good video features. If Sony’s version is smaller than Canon’s and offers manual video control I d go for it. If it s a zoom lens that covers useful focal length, the better.
Holyfan
2 years ago |the only thing I can see this fixed lens APSC camera having an advantage over G1X is if it has a built-in EVF using a range finder design. The G1X is very ugly and the viewfinder is useless while takes up a lot of space. The swivel screen of G1X is very good though, I hope Sony’s camera will have a 180 degree swivel screen or even touchscreen touch-focus capability.
Hopefully the lens will have a f2.8-4 16-70mm lens (I wish for a 2.8 constant but I know it would be impossible to keep size down)
Sky_walker
2 years ago |What you say for Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar 14,3-71,5mm f/2,8-4,8?
Frosti7
2 years ago |is the hybrid would be ff?
Carl
2 years ago |It would be much easier to design if it was APS. Folks around here would probably be pretty dejected if it was, though.
Sky_walker
2 years ago |FF would be much more expensive and cast some doubts on a point of whole FS video line. But we’ll see. I bet for APS-C as this is compatible with both systems and won’t make the price astronomically-high.
passer-by
2 years ago |Hybrid mount is considered as a workaround for FF NEX since current flange distance is just too short. FF would need at least 27mm. Introducing yet another mount is not a smart move. So there’s still hope that there will be an FF Hybrid camera, not necessarily as compact as current NEX.
Frosti7
2 years ago |But since the e-mount is big enough for ff, can’t they just produce ff lens with 27mm flange distance?
Carl
2 years ago |Sony.
Produce lens.
That’s where your (otherwise fine) idea failed.
passer-by
2 years ago |Making such lens is like introducing yet another lens mount, although it’s a possible solution. The easiest way that I can think of is to fit an FF sensor in the NEX-7, but FF capability only activated when an adapter such as LEA-1/2 is attached. With ordinary NEX lenses, it operates in crop mode.
This way we can travel light with small E-mount lenses and attach full frame lenses via adapter only when needed. Chipped(for FF capability activation) M-mount to E-mout adapter would be very much welcomed.
Varn
2 years ago |Getting the fixed lens APS-C compact, from Sony’s history this should be a great camera, thanks admin.
Neo NiGHTS ®
2 years ago |I’d like more to see a camera like the excellent V1/V3. Sony could very well bring that V series back.
hanugro
2 years ago |Don’t see the need given adapter like LA-EA2 is available. Just develop LA-EA3. Unless Sony wants to give A-mount the chance to use all other lens like NEX.
Sky_walker
2 years ago |I guess they want to develop something more in line of DSLR ergonomics and handling while keeping the ability to switch mounts. This would be much more than NEX with LA-EA.
Joel Richards
2 years ago |I could see that but only if they’re thinking seriously of phasing out the Alpha line which I don’t believe they will do unless they’ve figured out PDAF on the main sensor. Even still I’m with hanugro I don’t really see the point. LA-EA adapter already have turned the NEX line into a functioning hybrid plus aren’t the diameters of the mount really similar? I don’t have any Alpha mount gear so I’m not certain, but that would make mounting NEX lenses almost impossible without some kind of removable piece.
Sky_walker
2 years ago |I don’t see that as anything announcing the phase-out of Alpha line. NEX serves completely different purpose and is limited to APS-C, so such hybrid would be more of the A-mount alpha with option to use e-mount lenses for video than anything else.
lemon
2 years ago |Look like it will be an exciting time for Sony this Summer. Can’t wait to see how their APS-C compact is like. Better than Canon’s I hope.
Will these camera be announced earlier or @ Photokina?
sheng
2 years ago |thx for update this…i dont know if i will wait this or just buy G1x..
what i want about this camera is:
1. more pocketable size than g1x…
2. 1080 60p+. video.
3. 400 shot battery life.
4. a better viewfinder. o/e
5. can shot marco.
6. most important thing for me is: I want a more manipulative camera. I want more buttons and dials. A Camera can let me enjoy the process of shooting.
Artichoke
2 years ago |The APS-C compact will only be a winner if it:
–has an extraordinary lens
–has a great EVF
–has at least 18 MP
–is at least as cool-looking as the NEX-7
–makes great pictures–i.e. as good as NEX-7 w/Zeiss 24
–sticks the video start button somewhere else.
IF IT CAN DO ALL THOSE THINGS, THEN YOU’RE LOOKING AT THE “CAMERA OF THE YEAR” FOR THE 3RD CONSECUTIVE YEAR.
japb
2 years ago |Agreed it has to ship without lag issues (evf & controls), look good, and intuitive to use like NEX-7.
Although it’s irrelevant how many more MP a ‘compact’ have over 10MP. And i doubt any zoom lens on aps-c can ever be as good as NEX-7/Zeiss 24 combination.
Rooru S.
2 years ago |how much are you willing to pay for it? Remember that Sony needs to get a lot of money and too cheap with lots of features will get nothing compared to what they really need without hurting dSLR sales.
Maddmack
2 years ago |This camera, if it has a good zoom range say 28 to 120 would be a perfect re placement for my g10..
I’m an A850& A77 owner, when I bought the G10, Sony had nothing that fit what I wanted to do with a fixed lens camera. (dive camera)
Sony think about making a waterproof housing
For this new camera good to 120 feet
The clear plastic one cannon made was simple and works well
I’m off to shoot some birds and landscapes with my low ISO monster A77.
Don’t leave home without a camera of some kind.
Respect maddmack
Ken Ford
2 years ago |What Artichoke said!
hugo
2 years ago |The A99 will the the very first FF camera with EVF and therefore … with focus peaking and magnification inside the finder! This is going to be so awesome to use this camera with lots of legacy lenses. I predict the A99 will sell well on this feature alone.
And, if they can release it at a lower price point thx to lower evf cost that could be the nail in the coffin for the 5DIII. Higher frame rate, constant AF in video, low noise shutter, high iso noise, all the advantages the 5DIII has over the D800 could be made even stronger in the A99.
But Sony would seriously need to release high quality 24-105/f4 and 70-200/f4 lenses as well as good 35mm and 50mm lenses to take all benefits of their current tech advantages.
Sky_walker
2 years ago |“I predict the A99 will sell well on this feature alone.” – really depends on a marketing and reviews. So far I haven’t seen Sony advertise this feature at all for SLTs. And IMO this thing along with ability to actually see pixel-perfectly where bokeh begins before and after sharp area is a game-changer. Something you cannot get anywhere else but increases the comfort of work and accuracy by insane amount.
obican
2 years ago |Sadly, you won’t be able to mount a lot of legacy lenses on to A-Mount. The flange distance is too much, you can’t mount FD, you can’t mount M42, you can’t mount Nikon F. The last one is theoreticly possible but I haven’t heard of an adapter without corrective lenses for focusing at infinity.
Daryl Pineda
2 years ago |Maybe that’s where the hybrid mount comes into play. Full frame camera with hybrid mount to be able to use adapters for different lenses on its e-mount bayonet with focus peaking with stills and video. In the process, it finally creates a new niche for videographers: FULL FRAME MIRRORLESS that directly competes with Canon’s 5D and Nikon’s D800. Sony’s video expertise merged with alpha at its finest.
Joel Richards
2 years ago |M42? Yeah, you can.
SonyFanBoi
2 years ago |LOL, such ignorant statement. Sony Alpha mount is the most flexible SLR mount, only second to Canon EF mount. Canon might have it easier with simply using adapter but you have to shave the mirror box (or the back of the lens) on some mounts. Sony Alpha, on the hand, with custom made mount (i.e. Leitax) would not need any dangerous shaving. And I know these work so well because I have adapted Leica R, Contax Zeiss, M42 and Nikon F on my A900.
obican
2 years ago |If it’s compitable only with changing the whole mount, it doesn’t count as compitable.
My Porsche 911 is an excellent off road vehicle. Don’t worry, it had a fully reversible conversion.
quoll
2 years ago |What rubbish. I have 50mm and 135mm M42 Takumars on my A65 via cheap chipped adapters. Both achieve infinity focus. No changing of lens mount required.
obican
2 years ago |Oh wait, I thought they were changing the mount on the body. Disregard my last comment
Sky_walker
2 years ago |Why would I want to mount legacy lenses to A-mount, again? What for? With Zeiss, Minolta, KM, or even Sony’s own lenses? Why struggle when you get get better lenses with AF?
japb
2 years ago |@obican lookup leitax. Infinity focus on F mount is possible, which includes Voigtlander F mount lenses. Leitax also have a similar solution for Leica R lenses (ebay also have some with AF confirm).
M42 is easy because the hard work have been done by others in the last few years. But it also enables the use of Contax MM. Contax MM to M42 adapter + M42 to A mount adapter. I think there’s also Hasselblad medium format adapters with AF confirm on ebay.
And if you’re willing to diy, you can replace the lens mount of Pentax PK lenses with M42 mounts and use the M42 to Alpha adapters.
So that’s:
- Nikon F (and Voigtlander by Cosina)
- Leica R
- M42
- Contax MM
- Hasselblad
All with buy it now solutions and AF confirm. I don’t know of any other DSLR mount with IBIS that can mount as varied lenses.
japb
2 years ago |Sorry, by AF confirm, i meant focus confirm. Of course they all will be manual focus.
Renato S.
2 years ago |I bet that if Sony could go back in time and redesign the NEX system better, they would. So far it feels like they designed it so the body could be ultra small and that it would attract a certain type of photographer and that the enthusiasts and PROs would stay with the SLT cameras, but they got it wrong and now they don’t know how to solve to get decent lenses for E-Mount.
Joel Richards
2 years ago |I would have agreed with you several months ago but Sigma has shown that you CAN develop quality lenses for NEX that aren’t to big with great image quality. Sigma (or somebody else) just needs to start building a wider range of faster primes.
Renato S.
2 years ago |Yeah, it’s true, the Sigma was even reviewed as the best NEX lens, which should make both Sony and Zeiss ashamed, but I’m still counting that as an exception. Because if it’s that simple, I can’t understand what are they holding back or why they are doing that? Or maybe you can’t push much more than f/2.8 and still keep the quality? I don’t know, something is really weird here and that’s my point.
I’m using old Nikon lenses with adapter, but as soon as I see a better camera, I’m ready to shift system and abandon the NEX ship. It’s frustrating to feel that you can’t commit to the system because it doesn’t have lenses. It’s nice to use old glass, manual focus, but there are times, mainly for handheld video shots when I would love to have a IS working or when you are shooting some action, to have a fast AF for all those 10+fps burst mode.
If m4/3 had a camera with the IBIS and Image processor done by Olympus and all the Video feats done by Panasonic, I would buy that camera. If Fuji had a better video or if a Samsung had a better overall camera, I would buy it. But for now, the NEX has the better overall hybrid featured camera for me, but not the best system and definitely the crappiest lenses. For now, I’ll wait.
Sahaja
2 years ago |It’s pretty easy, and relatively cheap, to make a very good normal prime lens that has a maximum aperture of only 2.8. There are several very good old designs to choose from which would require little modification.
If Sony were to release a normal prime lens with a maximum aperture of only f2.8 how many people would be interested – and how many complain?
Rooru S.
2 years ago |I have to completely disagree with you. They will lose a lot of the current user base if they designed the E-mount at least 1mm longer. The ability to use almost any of the lens available of this planet is what gives the NEX (and it’s APS-C sensor) a special value. Samsung NX-mount (just a few mm more compared to E-mount) can’t mount M-mount lenses at all.
And I am pretty sure, if they design the body and mount to be longer than current E-mount, that would make pretty much the advantage negligible over what you lose. For example, If you increase the register distance, how much would you decrease the overall lenght of the lens+body compared to current E-mount lens size? Look at Samsung cameras. Yeah, their lenses are smaller than E-mount lenses but how about the overall lenght of body+lens? I would rather have the ability to mount M-mount lenses than gaining weigth and size.
c
2 years ago |but no microlenses
SonyFanBoi
2 years ago |Well, the 5N is just as good as the Ricoh M module and Leica dig. M.
Renato S.
2 years ago |.
Renato S.
2 years ago |Not really. Fuji has even shorter flange distance, but they engineered in a way to use the back focus distance better so they can keep the high quality optics, without distortions on the edges, without making massive lenses, etc. Just loot at the reviews, the X-Mount lenses are very high quality, some or one of them was even compared to Leica’s. So to redesign the NEX System doesn’t mean to get a longer flange distance, it just means to do it better. How can you disagree with that?
Besides, what’s the point of having such a camera if you have your priority backwards? I mean, why don’t you just launch a system made for adapters then? What’s the point of having a system that you can’t have quality glass of your own?
And going back to X-Mount, so it’s possible to keep a short flange distance and have quality optics, what’s the excuse for Sony then? There is no way to back it up for Sony’s lack of commitment to this system, unless you are a blind fool.
Rooru S.
2 years ago |I did disagree with you because you were talking about Sony pushing towards getting the smallest body. That means, you were talking about increasing the register distance in order to get better designs of lenses. If not, sorry for misunderstanding what you said with “it feels like they designed it so the body could be ultra small”.
The other part, how it’s possible to keep a short flange distance and have quality optics? Charging premium price for those lenses and bodies of course. And, you can’t expect a camera system to have 15 lenses in the first year, do you? It will take some time to build up the basement of the NEX system.
But I do agree on this, Sony lack of commitment to E-mount and even A-mount is clear. Every Sony user before or after purchasing an alpha knows this but are expecting that they wake up and/or are just fine with the current options.
Vivek
2 years ago |Wides and ultrawides with very short flange focus like the Cosina 12mm and 15mm do exceptionally well on a NEX-C3 and the Fuji X-Pro-1 both with a 16MP sensor.
I have been using other esoteric lenses with even shorter flange focus on the C3 with no ill effects.
The same lenses behave badly on a NEX-5 or the 7.
Renato S.
2 years ago |But Zeiss glass is premium is even so it loses to Sigma? It’s weird, it doesn’t make sense. Sigma made a 199$ quality glass, so what’s wrong here? I think you are blind man, E-Mount doesn’t even have quality 600$ lenses like Fuji to complain about.
And unfortunately it’s not just one year of NEX System, it’s been 2-years already. NEX and NX have been out there for about the same time but the difference in lenses are enormous. But not just that, the roadmap of NEX is just nonsense while NX roadmap is what people really want, fast primes, pancakes, etc. It’s not even about having 15 lenses, but why having lenses that is not what people want? Fuji just started and they have very nice options in a 18mm f/2, 35mm f/1.4, 60mm f/2.4 macro!
I think that a part of NEX users don’t really care about lenses, the entry-level people usually buy 2 zooms and that’s about that. There is a part of NEX users that thought Sony would change and make the lenses, since they kind of said so and there is those that are ok with that or like me, just waiting to abandon ship.
Sahaja
2 years ago |The Zeiss lens doesn’t “loose to Sigma” the Sigma lens is not 24mm and it is not f1.8.
Optically one of the best Nikon lenses I’ve ever owned was their cheap 50mm f2.0 – much sharper and much cheaper than their 50mm f 1.4 lens of the same period.
If you want to make a slow normal prime that is fantastically sharp you could probably just take an old enlarging lens design, add modern coating, a focusing mechanism, and an E-mount.
Rooru S.
2 years ago |@Renato S.: Sigma is Quality glass BUT, slower, not as wide as 24 (which is more complex to do) and every 24mm faster than f/2 with AF is more challenging to build than a 30mm f/2.8. And you forgot, I’m talking about bodies too, they’re charging premium for an APS-C model, and others 35mm f/1.4 and even FF (although MF only like the Rokinon) are priced less than the well regarded Fuji lens. The only impressive lens to me is the 18mm f/2 in terms of construction, performance and price.
I know it has been 2 years. I have my NEX-5 since sept 2010. If I said about 15 lenses in the first year is because there is some people expecting to see a bunch of lenses to appear like magic. Do You know that lenses take some time to research and develop? so your so wanted lens will take some time to appear, at least if you want a good quality lens. And I’m pretty sure, you know NEX-series was first created for people jumping from P&S to more powerful cameras, therefore, they want the general consumer with money to spend on a zoom lens to buy it. the 18-200, or people that will buy the 1855 and 55210. They’re not into “wanted” lenses like a normal fast prime, or a good wide zoom or a longer macro yet as they want money first, sad but true. Maybe you failed to see what’s the priority of Sony, and that is, make money from bodies bundled with kit lens. Main market is Japan and they know the number of sales. That’s why you see a bunch of zoom lenses in the roadmap and not specialty “wanted” lenses.
I’m with the NEX-series because of the ability to mount most lenses in the world in the best bodies for the money. It seems you’re for the native E-mount lenses. And getting back to the main theme, the E-mount is good enough at it is. They just need to be more serious and aggressive about what they’re doing with the lenses without worrying about competition (let’s say, themselves with the A-mount).
Walt
2 years ago |The ability to adapt all sorts of other mounts to E mount is not a plus for Sony as that’s no sales of lenses for them. The real money to be made in ILC cameras is in lens sales, not bodies, which are the cheap part of the system.
Joel Richards
2 years ago |Except that Sony has made it clear lenses aren’t the their focus hence they opened the e-mount up to third party manufacturers. Sony is an electronics company and they know how to make those bodies and turn a profit. That’s why they keep releasing all these new bodies.
Sahaja
2 years ago |Where are *all* those 3rd party E-mount lenses? So far there has only been a minor trickle.
How come Samsung – also an electronics company – has managed to release a decent range of lenses for their NX cameras? They didn’t even have the benefit of buying a camera and lens company like Minolta.
Sony should be doing better.
matgay
2 years ago |1.) Walt: make emount not compatible for 3rd party, so only sony lenses sell
2.) sell sensor to nikon d800 with exclusivity, so only nikon lenses sell
arent these two strategies a little contradictory? or does sony make some money off of nikon lenses? no wonder samsung sells tv’s “TO” SONY
Sky_walker
2 years ago |“The real money to be made in ILC cameras is in lens sales” – obviously it’s not the case for Sony. They are largest electronics & sensor manufacturer in the cameras market so they can get far better profits on each camera sold than anyone else out there.
Unless… I’m missing something and Sony is just playing an idiot with releasing X-bodies and no lenses what so ever meanwhile…
Sahaja
2 years ago |Over the long haul no interchangeable lens camera system is going to sell well and be profitable without a decent range of interchangeable lenses to go with it.
AG
2 years ago |APS-C means this will be a big fixed lens. Why not a better walk around lens for the Nex E-mount covering 24-105 f/4.
hugo
2 years ago |imo the wait for good prime lenses on the nex is pretty much over: excellent 19mm, 24mm, 30mm, 50mm lenses in native mount. I would add two fast 35mm and 90mm, and maybe a 10mm or 12mm and that would be it.
Now we need good macros lenses at 60mm+ and three good standard, wide and telephoto zoom lenses. (I bet a wide high quality zoom would sell very well)
Yo
2 years ago |One thing about the A99 FF thing. Don’t call it A99. Call it either A97, or A95. That’s a subtle way to show there will be updates. But then again, who knows…
mein
2 years ago |It might be a camera that won’t be updated for 4 years. And in time the 37, 57, 77 cameras will be updated to 39, 59, 79. Sony might drop the A65.
JSWinNYC
2 years ago |I’d like to see this camera with the 24mp sensor please. I like my NEX 7, but for travel and family I would like the simplicity of a camera like the G1X.
A.a.
2 years ago |Would be great to see it with a IISO like many Minolta cameras had-eg. My Z2, The 7Hi and A2 both had one and a 921k screen, do you could use any Alpha or third-party flash unit or flash accessory.
The R1 had a standard hotshoe-not one that accepts Alpha flashes.
kei1309
2 years ago |nice. how fantastic that the “O” in the ISO test on the A77 is always OOF, giving you the feel that the Noise control is much much more terrible than it actually is
Sahaja
2 years ago |There have been hybrid mount cameras before – but can anyone think of one that was really successful?
Jbob
2 years ago |Requirements
15-100mm zoom (moderately fast)
Rugged
Waterproof to 50ft
Bright EVF
FAST AF
no bigger than G1X
4” OLED screen
Dennis_photo
2 years ago |This rumour roundup mentions the Leica X1. Now Leica has announced the X2, http://www.dpreview.com/news/2012/05/10/Leica-uveiles-X2-16MP-CMOS-APS-C-premium-camera-with-24mm-F2.8-36mm-equivalent-lens
It features an APS-C sized CMOS sensor with 16,2 Mpx and a crop factor of 1.5.
I wonder if this is a sensor that is very familiar to reader of Sony rumour sites.
Does anyone know who manufacures sensors for Leicas cameras?